Battle System
Posted by DanielI’m working on a brand new battle system for our next game. I’ve come up with a few ideas for additions as well as issues that I would like to address.
Streamlined Battles
The first thing I decided to cut was evasion. When an enemy evades your attacks, it just wastes time. It means you’re just going to have to choose another move.
I want to make a streamlined battle system where your time is used very efficiently. I’m removing things like the pre turn choice of “fight” or “escape”. This is just one more button press every turn.
Random good things happening
Random numbers can be really frustrating, things like evasion and strong enemy moves that are set off randomly. I would like a battle system where the only random things that would happen are good things.
Perhaps you randomly get an extra turn, a critical strike, an extra item drop. Things like this would serve to make the battles more fun and less tedious.
Spell Variety
Very few games get this right. Either you don’t have enough spells and you just use the same one over and over or you have too many spells and they all just do the same thing.
If the only difference between a fireball and a lightning bolt is the graphics then what’s the point? It’s only fun to see the pretty graphics a few times, after that it’s just a chore.
Even with the right combination of spells you still have a problem. If each spell has one specific use then there’s only one strategy to use. This again just leads to boredom.
Unlimited possibilities
The goal of this new battle system is to offer many possibilities. I want to give the player a whole bunch of tools and let them choose how they want to use them. I also want to add more variety to battles. It shouldn’t just be choose 4 moves, wait, then choose 4 more.
Lessons from Dawn’s Light
When we were designing the battle system in Dawn’s Light we felt very limited. Even after making many changes to the battle system there were still a lot of things that just could not be done.
We tried to make the battles interesting by offering moves with unique effects. We added a combo system for some of the characters to encourage the player to use different moves.
In the end I think we succeeded in making the battles more interesting but there’s still a lot more that can be done. With this new battle system we can do anything we want. So if it doesn’t work, I can’t blame it on the limits in the existing battle system.
So what would you like to see in a new battle system?
I loved the fact that you provided percentages, or a threat system, to let us know who would be the target of an enemy’s attack. Along the same lines, I would love to have a system that tells me who is likely to attack first from my group. It always seems that my characters attack in random order. Maybe I just don’t notice an order and I don’t know if this is standard RPG stuff, since I never actually played any RPG’s on any console or computer system until Aveyond.
Love everything else you mentioned above…hate evasion (when I’m not the one doing the evading) and love lots of spell variety both in usefulness and uniqueness. Also, for personal preference, I do like having a character with some sort of status/rejuvenation abilities and having characters a little bit more even in their abilities, so that one character doesn’t get relegated to support/potions duty all the time.
Turn order comes from speed, whoever has the highest speed goes first. I agree that it seems random and really it is. There’s too many things contributing, perhaps one character is a higher level, perhaps you just got new armor. None of them are decisions so in the end it’s just random.
In the next game I’m planning to have just one piece of equipment that gives speed. If you put on armor with high speed you can expect to go first. That way it’s more of a choice.
The reason we didn’t have a healer in Dawn’s Light is that we designed the characters before we decided their roles. Once we started to work on the battle system is was too late. Vera would have had to be the healer and it just didn’t fit.
We’ve learned from our mistake and this time we are definitely going to have a healer. =)
I know this is actually counter-intuitive… but ere’ we go!
1) Why not have a cause-effect spell system?
In its simplest form, we’re talking Pokemon stuff. Summon a rain-storm and increase the power of your water and electricity attacks. In it’s highest form, using an ice attack after using a fire attack can potentially insta-kill metal based enemies.
2) What about some classic stuff?
Like… using Soft on a stone-based monster to instantly kill it?
3) How about something that gives an ode to Live-A-Live?
Perhaps using fire based attacks on a plant decreases its stats and having healing items increase your own stats in addition to healing?
4) Why stop with making standard attacks a backup?
Why not make some enemies immune to physical while others have a huge weakness to it? How about allowing weapons to augment your physical attacks into hitting all enemies instead of just one? Basically, what do you think of the Golden Sun approach to weapon mechanics, and would there be anything from it that you would implement?
5) Mounts and Buddy-Buddy
I loved Suikoden 3’s system of mounting your characters on certain non-humanoid party members, granting boosted stats and some unique options due to their turns going at the same time. Similarly, I enjoyed the fact that some characters could perform special attacks when paired with each other (simplified in Suikoden 5). Would this be something worth doing in the new game?
6) Title Rewards?
Is there a chance you could implement a (if humorous) “Tales of” title system, or something similar? Heck, maybe even start giving titles to places you’ve been or creatures you’ve met?
7) In battle character comments and possible conversations?
Does anyone here NOT remember Final Fantasy 6’s hilarious reaction to casting magic in front of Edgar and Locke? Please… answer my wish for more games to do something like this! Oh, and skits/Fire Emblem banter. I can feel myself salivating.
Would it be too much to ask for difficulty levels?
Yeah… a lot of the stuff I’ve mentioned is actually in the face of what you’re trying to do, but I can’t help but ask? In any case, that’s a load off MY chest. I’m hoping you guys don’t regret asking for opinions on your blog! It really does wonders for my (and no doubt many others) mental health. Ha! *thumbs up*
I felt like there wasn’t enough skill variety in Dawn’s Light.
Mashed the same set of attacks pretty often.
Quick Stab -> Double Stab(Contagious if a boss first, then again when it wears off)
Tyson’s 0 mana attack that his single targets hard but causes him to take damage. Used the bleed skill on high hp targets that weren’t immune to it sometimes.
Virgils armor piercing attack. Used the heal attack a few times.
Harvey had the most utility skill set. Call of X skills were well done, giving you an option of stats, or a purge/status immunities, or armor buff that doesn’t seem to do much.. Tactical strike for a tiny armor debuff, and mocking strike to use his tanking equipment and high hp. AE attack. Don’t think I ever used Strategic Strike after the first boss where you get it.
From the list of spells, you could have it that only X number of them are available on a turn, and which ones it is are random. Or if you want all spells available, randomly some spells are considerably cheaper to cast, each turn.
Also tying into your random good things, each spell could have different random good things, so as to differentiate them more.
Why not something like Chrono Cross’s field system? You can use it to raise or lower the effectiveness of certain spells.